Healthy Working Lives ľ Ahead for health
NHS Mental Health Awareness.
Toolbox Talk.
Two groups from different workplaces chat with an employment specialist, Richard Scothorne,
about mental health issues.
There are also two animated workers.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE, employment specialist] Mental might seem like an odd topic for a
Toolbox Talk, but in fact thousands of man hours are lost every year as a result of people
not taking care of their mental health.
Hi everyone.
I'm not a doctor.
I'm an expert in employee welfare, so I'm looking for some common sense suggestions
and I hope these guys are going to help.
[CAPTION: Ahead for health
Looking after the smartest tool in the box.]
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] So Friday morning, a long week how's it been?
[PAUL MOONEY, joiner] Friday's always a good day, going into the
weekend.
[CRAIG GUTHRIE, painter and decorator] Generally at the end of the week after putting
in your shifts and your graft and if there's any overtime then I'd say you get a little
bit tired by the end of that.
So, a wee bit of R and R is well deserved, and well looked forward to.
[MICHAELA ROBINSON, apprentice plumber] The week's been long, the days are so long,
Monday's so long so I'm glad it's Friday, a short day.
[COLIN MCMULLAN, joiner] You always feel better Friday.
Friday, it's the end of the week, you're looking forward, you've got the weekend.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] And how are you feeling mentally?
[COLIN MCMULLAN] I'm mentally fine, physically struggling,
ha! [laughter]
[STEPHEN MACKAY, joiner] Every day you think, what am I gonna' be doing,
what am I gonna' be doing, what's gonna' happen?
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] And what's that mentally like?
[STEPHEN MACKAY] Mentally, aye, exciting but also nervous.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] Nervous?
[STEPHEN MACKAY] Yep.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] And what do you do about that?
[STEPHEN MACKAY] Ehů try not to think about it so much.
[SAM FERGUSON, engineer] I take things, life too seriously, if you
know what I mean.
[Richard Scothorne: uh huh].
I would get stressed first before any of the company here.
[Richard Scothorne: hmm mm] I like just nothing going wrong, if you know what I mean.
[IAIN ROLLO, plater] I don't think I get stressed to be honest
with you.
Maybe my wife would tell you different, but I think I'm quite easy ozy.
I think I dement her half the time because of that attitude.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] So how would you respond if one of your workmates
had a mental health issue?
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Ah it doesn't make me think any less of them.
Just try ľ know ask them ľ if you feel they're approachable or, and see what you can do.
If you can give them any advice, if you could.
[JOHN LOGUE, caulker burner] When it's work related, if it's maybe more
in their personal life it's maybe different.
I just tend to find, you see somebody having problems, you speak to them, try and understand
their problems and try and maybe, know, help them.
[PAUL MOONEY] You get guys whoů "I'm not working with him,
he's a nutter".
And you're going, "How's he a nutter?"
"Oh, there's something wrong with him, he's always things on his mind."
And you're saying, "But that doesn't make him a nutter!"
It's more a slagging each other, we would probably more slag them and bring them back
in, "You're not getting any sympathy in here, you want somebody to, away home to your missus,
don't come in here looking for sympathy."
And just get on with it.
And that's probably the way we deal with it.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] And is that, is that a good idea?
Does that work?
[PAUL MOONEY] Sometimes.
Sometimes it might look as if it's working but you could be, the guy inside could be
going to bits and you'll not know unless they open up to you.
[ANIMATION ľ one character examines the other's head]
[CHARACTER 1] Awff brilliant, that's all we need.
Come on, stick your bunnet up.
Hey ho ho hey, phew, you're totally done in here my man.
When did you last have a break?
[CAPTION: Keep Active.
Take a Break]
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] How about breaks.
Do you manage to get away from it all?
[IAIN ROLLO] The only break you really get during the working
day is at the dinner time.
I mean, the type of work we do, it's not as if you can just stand about, and if the gaffer
comes up and asks you, "What you doing?", say, "I'm having a break."
Well, that is a no no.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] What do you do in your breaks?
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Just generally have a cup of tea and have
a chat with the boys.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] And does that feel like a real break?
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Yeah, it's a break at the same time, yeah,
but you get away, just, obviously you need something to eat but you get away and you're
sitting in with the rest of the boys, some of them are different squads, so then you
can have a chat with them.
Our work's left in here, try and leave it in here, butů
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] How do you doů that's a very deliberate act?
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Oh I just try, leave that behind you, know
you, you don't want to be working 24/7.
[PAUL MOONEY] When you're talking to your missus she's going,
"What are you talking about?"
half of the time.
So you talk to people in the same sort of game as yourselves, so, you're always in amongst
that, even if it's in the pub, you're sitting, "How's it in at work today, what's that site
like and what's another site like?"
So, [Richard Scothorne: uh uh] it's always there.
But it is a way of de-stressing you, Ĺcos when you're talking about it, you're letting
off a bit of steam about somebody that's annoyed the life out you that day.
"Did you see that git what he was doing the day?"
So, you get it out your system then.
[MICHAELA ROBINSON] I can switch off, but it's hard to.
But I want to leave my work at my work, and not anywhere, we don't want to take it home
and then cause arguments with my family, so, I'd rather just leave it here.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] What do the rest of you do to switch off?
Paul, you must do something to switch off completely?
[PAUL MOONEY] Play games on the computer.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] Really?
[PAUL MOONEY] That's my chill.
[COLIN MCMULLAN] I go fishing, I like to go away, well I just
go out on the boat and, and we chill out there altogether.
There's no noise whatsoever, just relax.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] Let's talk a bit about exercise, you're talking,
was someone going to the gym?
Who was going to the gym?
[STEPEN MACKAY] Some of us go to the gym!
[Laughter]
[COLIN MCMULLAN] I play five-a-sidesů
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] You play five-a-sides?
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Five-a-sides and that, aye but justů
[PAUL MOONEY] The only exercise I get is walking.
I like walking just myself, just wandering about, that clears my head.
[CRAIG GUTHRIE] We've got our own little lock-up and we basically
just have loose weights and we go and work out, three times a week for a couple of hours.
Em, and I can forget all about work, I can just shut it off.
[SAM FERGUSON] I like doing the running, the marathons, the
half marathon, and go down to London and Dublin and things like that.
I'm very active, I'm hyper, that's the word I'm looking at, hyper, all the time.
I've got to be on the go all the time.
[CAPTION: Keep Active.
Take a Break.]
[ANIMATION ľ one character examines the other, referring to a User Manual]
[CHARACTER 2] Oof ho ho, oof, sorry about that, I've been
a bit stressed lately.
[CHARACTER 1] Ah no bother son, we've all been there.
[CHARACTER 2] Look thanks for helping.
It's good to have somebody to talk to.
[CHARACTER 1] Eh?
It's alright, you'd do the same for me wouldn't you?
[CHARACTER 2] Aye.
Maybe I'll go and see my maw, she always cheers me up.
[CHARACTER 1] Ah ha!
[CAPTION: Care for Others
Keep in Touch]
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] And when was the last time you helped someone
out?
Can you tellů any stories you can tell us?
[COLIN MCMULLAN] I think Monday ha!
Well, Tuesday it was.
Stephen was off on Monday, it's not like him, and he came in, and he had problems at home.
It was a relationship thing, but we spoke to him Tuesday, we knew, the head was down,
you could tell Stevie, the head was down and that but, he, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday,
that's him back on the ball just.
Quiet, quiet word andů
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] And that was talking, listening?
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Yeah.
Just a quiet word in his ear, and speak to him and then, slag him in front of everybody,
that's what we do after that but.
[STEPEN MACKAY] Back to normality it is.
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Back to normality, bring him back in.
Justů
[STEPEN MACKAY] I think they found people'll bottle up, well
me especially, I'll bottle it up, bottle it up, bottle itů And it goes on for so long
and then, just ľ bang ľ everything just comes together, all the wee things come together
and it just, like a volcano, you just, erupt and then, and then that's it.
And you have to get back to normality just, back to your friends, talking normally, and
then, as soon as you can start having a laugh and a joke.
I wasn't speaking to anybody, I was just quiet, and it's not like me.
And then, everybody asked, "How are you?"
And then, that's it, back to the slagging match, back to the, the banter in work, which
gets you through it.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] And back to the real Stevie.
[STEPEN MACKAY] Yep.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] Uh huh.
And how about eh, friends and family, how often do you see them?
[MICHAELA ROBINSON] Every day.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] Every day?
[MICHAELA ROBINSON] Yeah.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] And does that, does that make you feel good?
[MICHAEL ROBINSON] It does uh huh.
And I can talk to them if I need them.
[CRAIG GUTHRIE] We actually spend more time in here than what
we do with our own families.
So we talk to each other more than we do with our own families as well.
And, we share the same problems, issues, the ups and the downs that everybody else has
in life.
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Your kids a lot of the time, when people go
home it's more the kids and the wife, know ha!
The wife's run of the mill you get her every day, you usually get the grief off her when
you go in but, the wee one you get the same every time, she comes up, "Daddy, daddy",
big cuddles.
[PAUL MOONEY] Usually if there's a game of football on the
telly, phone a couple and just go, instead of sitting watching in the house yourself,
go down to the pub and watch it.
Even if you're not bevvying, you're still in amongst everybody getting a laugh and a
carry on.
[COLIN MCMULLAN] That's if your team's playing well.
[laughter]
[PAUL MOONEY] Obviously, Colin doesn't want to talk about
fitba, you know what I mean!
[laughter]
[COLIN MCMULLAN] That can be, that can be stressful!
[CAPTION Care for Others
Keep in Touch]
[ANIMATION ľ the characters are in the pub] [CHARACTER 1]
That.
Was one.
Rotten day.
One.
Really.
Totally.
Rotten.
Day.
[CHARACTER 2] Rotten.
[CHARACTER 1] Really, totally, absolutely, rrrrottten!
(burp)
[CHARACTER 1] This is gonna be one, rotten day.
[CAPTION: Eat Well.
Drink Sensibly.]
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] So, let's talk about food, and eh, what did
you have for breakfast?
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Nothing.
Always buyů breakfast, just a cup of tea and a biscuit in the morning in the way in
here, we generally get our tea break half 10, 11 o'clock.
It's breakfast, whether it be sandwiches you bring or use the canteen.
[PAUL MOONEY] I'd say what sort of mood you're in but it's
hard to describe what sort of mood makes you go and eat.
But there's just mornings when you go, "Oh, I need a fry up", and other mornings I can
sit and get my cornflakes and that's alright you know.
[COLLIN MCMULLAN] I think once a week, you're allowed a blow
out once a week.
[Paul Mooney: aye] ůthe fry up once a week, I think.
Try and eat a regular balanced diet as you say, but, you're allowed a blow up once a
week.
I don't feel abstaining the whole time.
[PAUL MOONEY] Fry up's comfort food, do you know what I
mean, just a wee bit, don't feel likeů ah I'm going to the canteen so I can get a fry
up, makes you feel a wee bit better, it does me anyway.
[laugh]
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] And later in the day do you still feel, does
it still make you feel good?
[PAUL MOONEY] [overtalk] Naw, you're suffering later in
the day.
[laugh]
[IAIN ROLLO] I think if you eat what you want, but eat
less of it, well says me, I don't know.
RICHARD SCOTHORNE] What about drink?
You don't drink?
[CRAIG GUTHRIE] Yes please.
[laugh]
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] How much do you drink and when do you drink?
[CRAIG GUTHRIE] Well, I generally, I don't drink during the
week, but I do take a drink on a Friday night.
[COLIN MCMULLAN] I know people out on the site that have a
drink most nights, if not every night, but, generally myself it's a night out, but maybe
lucky if it's once a month or less, but I suppose you'll call it binge drinking Ĺcos
we do go out, we go out, know and enjoy it butů It's not, you're not gonna' have a lot
a drink during the week.
Very rarely.
[JOHN LOGUE] It makes me happy I would say, I quite enjoy
it, I really do, it's my, my one vice I would say.
Aye, thoroughly enjoy it.
[PAUL MOONEY] We're getting older now, aren't we mate? [laugh]
We travelled all overů [Colin McMullan: speak for yourself eh!] we travelled all over Britain
when you were, when you were a bit younger, and you were out bevvying every night, but
you could work it off the next day.
Can't do that now.
Just can't handle it all like that now.
So the hangovers kill me now.
And I feel rotten, Ĺcos I'll lie about all day and I feel as if I've lost a day.
And that's what sort of puts me off drinking as heavy as what I used to.
[CAPTION: Eat Well.
Drink Sensibly.]
[ANIMATION ľ one character examines the other's head with a vacuum cleaner]
[CHARACTER 1] Are you sure you know what you're doing in
there?
[CHARACTER 2] Aye.
Of course I do, now just relax.
[CHARACTER 1] Oh!
Oh!
[CHARACTER 2] Oh-ohů
[CHARACTER 1] Oooh.
Maybe you'd be better leaving this to an expert, eh?
[CHARACTER 2] Aye.
Aye, maybe you're right.
I'm not exactly a brain surgeon am I?
[CHARACTER 1] No, no, but you don't need to be that, you're
good at fixing vacuum cleaners.
[CAPTION: Do Something You're Good At
Accept Who You Are.]
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] Tell us about the things you're really good
at, what you love doing.
[STEPHEN MACKAY] What I'm really good atů my job.
[laugh] I like to think [Paul Mooney: wait a minute]ů You like to, you like, you like
to think you're good at your job.
[SAM FERGUSON] I think we're all good at what we do.
I think we're all very understanding people, then, or we wouldn't take the job as what
we do.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] Michaela how about you?
[MICHAELA ROBINSON] I really love driving, just go on drives,
anywhere, [Richard Scothorne: fast?] just driving.
Fast.
Oh.
No, just relaxing and listening to music and driving.
Yeah.
[STEPHEN MACKAY] Well, Colin thinks, likes to think he's good
at fishing, he thinks going out and spending ú700 on a new rod is the wee fish gonna go,
"Oh there's a seven hundred pound rod out there, I'm gonna' go for this one."
But it doesn't always work, a lot of the times you ů
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Stevie'll try and buy a better snowboard thinkingů
[laughter] it works the same, they're all the same.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] What are you not so good at?
[JOHN LOGUE] I was gonna say sitting in front of a camera,
but, I meanů [laughter]
[COLIN MCMULLAN] I'm not good at houseworků or ironing.
I just don't do that.
Housework justů [Michaela: see I'm good at that I can multitask too.]
No.
Whereas you find, Stevie'll tell you at the site, I, on my area, I always like it tidy.
I've got a bit of a phobia and my wife can't believe it.
She says, "How are you not like that in the house?"
Justů I just don't do housework, it's not my thing.
[PAUL MOONEY] My probably biggest bits, I'm not very good
at admitting I'm wrong.
You wouldn't believe that, would you?
[Laughter] That's my downfall.
[STEPHEN MACKAY] I'm not very good at hiding my feelings.
Definitely not.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] But it sounds important that you hang on to
the things that you know you're good at.
[PAUL MOONEY] If you're good at something you want to concentrate
on that.
As Colin said earlier on, we're out in the park, there's a certain job that you're good
at, you want to do that all the time.
You don't want to do something you're not good at and somebody saying, "Look at the
mess they're leaving there."
That's a different pressure again.
[Richard Scothorne: uh huh] So you try and get into the squad that's doing what you feel
comfortable doing.
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Me and Stevie are barred from working with
each other.
[Laughter] It's too much hilarity and carry on.
I think it's just butů the job gets done.
It would get done, it's probably faster than anything, but, we're doing the job, we know
the job's to be done so you don't ů you have a laugh but you're not, you're not not working.
[CAPTION: Do Something You're Good At
Accept Who You Are]
[ANIMATION ľ the characters are in a pub] [CHARACTER 2]
Are you sure you're alright big man?
[CHARACTER 1] Yeah, aye, look I'm good alright, I'm good,
good.
[CHARACTER 2] Aw naw, look out, he's gonna' blow!
[CHARACTER 1] Could I please have a glass of water?
[CAPTION: Talk About Your Feelings.
Ask For Help.]
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] Have any of you cried recently?
[PAUL MOONEY] At a funeral.
[Richard Scothorne: uh huh] Just before Christmas.
A good friend of mine died, so it's, I was carrying the coffin and, aye I was greetin'
that day.
Years ago I probably wouldn't have, but now I don't, I've just let it go a lot easier
than what I would have at one time.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] And did that help?
[PAUL MOONEY] It does help, aye, but I think it's just different
attitudes now.
At one time going to a funeral, the woman greeted, and the guys didn't.
That was just the way it was, but now it's a lotů it's changed.
People have moved on.
You'll see a lot more males greetin' at funerals than what you would ever, I think anyway,
personally.
And I think that's a good thing.
[CRAIG GUTHRIE] I left my wife, last, last year, it was for
a brief moment.
Em, I found that very hard.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] And did crying help you?
[CRAIG GUTHRIE] It was an outlet, but I'd ended up in such
a dark place I didn't understand why I was crying.
Because I shouldn't be crying, because I'm a 48 year old man that works in a shipyard,
and I couldn't understand my own emotions.
I didn't have a grasp on them.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] When you came back into, back to work you're
very open about that andů?
[CRAIG GUTHRIE] Yeah, because I'm telling you that shows how
open I've been about it.
People have, will come up and ask me now, how I'm getting on, "How's things?"
[STEPHEN MACKAY] Everybody, whether they admit it or not, if
they're themself, or, in a group, I would say everybody has a wee greet.
[PAUL MOONEY] Still probably bottle some things up at a
film so as you don't look stupid greetin' in front of a film or something like that
butů
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Oh there's something in my eye!
[laughter]
[PAUL MOONEY] Do you want a cup of tea?
[laughter]
[COLIN MCMULLAN] I can't, I need to go to the toilet.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] So letting your emotions show doesn't seem
like a sign of weakness anymore orů?
[PAUL MOONEY] It depends where it is.
You stand out there and greet on that park, guys are going to say, "What is the script
with him?"
And probably half of them would walk away from you, Ĺcos they wouldn't know how to
deal with it.
ĹCos it just, "That guy's breaking down, he's standing there roaring and greeting".
But the guy might have just had a phone call or something, you don't know until you actually
go and talk to them.
But I would say as Colin'll tell ye, he's out the park an all, probably what?
75 per cent would walk away from you, run away from you, until somebody actually went
over and found out what was wrong.
[STEPHEN MACKAY] They don't know what to say, they don't know
how to approach them.
If you see somebody crying out there, you're just like, "Phew what do I say?"
Do you know what I mean?
At the end of the day, us being out here, we've got to be mentally strong orů
[PAUL MOONEY] [overtalk] Got be a rough, big rough, tough,
rough construction workerů
[STEPHEN MACKAY] Aye you've got to be rough, rough and tough
or [Paul Mooney: it's no fair] you're putting lives, lives in danger at the end of the day.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] Has it ever felt all too much for anyone?
[PAUL MOONEY] Och aye, every second day.
[laughter] No really, it's, your coping strategies kick in.
You never get to that stage, well I've never got to that stage where you've just to say,
"enough's enough."
I think we've all got, some sort of venting system where we get it out our system.
That'll bring you back to a level where, it might not be perfect but we can get on with
everything.
[CAPTION: Talk About Your Feelings.
Ask for Help.]
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] So I've got here something for you.
The smartest tool in the box, have you ever seen one of these?
[Richard produces a plastic human brain from a toolbox]
[PAUL MOONEY] Aye at school, hundreds of year ago.
[STEPHEN MACKAY] Some of us only have half of that.
[PAUL MOONEY] There you go then.
[laughter]
[CRAIG GUTHRIE] Controls everything doesn't it.
Stress levels, emotions, the lot.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] How important a tool is that?
[COLIN MCMULLAN] It's the most important [Paul Mooney: it is]
tool in the box isn't it.
[PAUL MOONEY] Aye.
If you don't put your brain in gear, and you're beat aren't you?
From the minute you get out of your bed in the morning.
[RICHARD SCOTHORNE] Do you think you look after it?
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Yeah.
[PAUL MOONEY] Probably not 100 per cent the way we should,
but aye, I think reasonably.
[STEPHEN MACKAY] Do Something You're Good At.
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Keep Active.
[JOHN LOGUE] Care for Others.
[MICHAELA ROBINSON] Eat Well.
[IAIN ROLLO] Drink Sensibly.
[PAUL MOONEY] Talk About Your Feelings.
[CRAIG GUTHRIE] Ask For Help.
[SAM FERGUSON] Accept Who You Are.
[STEPHEN MACKAY] Keep In Touch.
[COLIN MCMULLAN] Take A Break.
[ANIMATION] [CHARACTERS 1 and 2]
Look after the smartest tool in the box.
[CAPTION: Ahead for health
Looking after the smartest tool in the box.]
[CREDIT: Many thanks to everyone who helped us produce
this DVD: BAE Systems, Naval Ships, Brookfield Multiplex, Mercury, Dunne and UCATT.
Icons supplied by the Mental Health Foundation.]
[END OF TRANSCRIPT]